Need for overdrives?

Technical questions and answers
tallergypsy
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu Dec 31, 2009 1:05 am

Need for overdrives?

Post by tallergypsy »

Good Morning,
My company in Vancouver makes the 'Roverdrive' overdrive for regular Series and Defenders. One of my personal vehicles is an early Australian 110 with an ISUZU diesel and my wife and I have just driven this from Cape Town to Mombasa. The gearbox is an LT95
I think the time has come to fit this vehicle with an overdrive and the gnomes in the workshop are making me one. I'm curious if there is any commercial demand for such an animal. There seem to be quite a few used Range Rover Faireys about especially in the UK with prices under UKL500.00. Opinion in Australia is that the Fairey is a bit weak for the Isuzu - I don't see this as being an issue with an LT95 'Roverdrive'. The Australian Army is due to sell off it's fleet of Parenties soon and demand from civilian owners may make such an overdrive commercially feasible.
A well made overdrive for an LT95 would have to sell for about UKL1200. Much as we love them Stage 1 V8s are not expensive vehicles and I was wondering if there would be much take up for this application in the U.K.
Any thoughts?
Ray Wood
Kiwistage1V8
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Post by Kiwistage1V8 »

I'm sure you would sell some.

I have a fairey OD in mine, and I paid NZ$200 and would not be able to justify 1200 pounds UK for one.

Although, I would be more than happy for you to send me one and to trial it for you. :wink: I promise to give rave reviews.

8)

Cheers
Stop Global Whining.
map1275
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Post by map1275 »

The rumour about the ADF selling off its fleet has been going around for the last 15 years so I wouldn't bet on this. When it does eventually happen I wouldn't be expecting some massive increase in demand for top line accessories.
I suggest you research the disposal of the ADF's Ser III fleet, the NZDF's disposal of its Stage Ones and the current market for 4wds.
map1275
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Location: Brisbane, Australia

Post by map1275 »

The Perentie & Bushranger both use alternate gearing in the transfer case. This was specifically intended to avoid the overdrive issue.

As the tightwad market has been flogging this idea for many years to justify not having an overdrive, I doubt this is going to be a sales point towards an OD.

I suspect the new owners will be more concerned with how quickly they need to change their clutches, rear main seals, or LT95s as the Isuzu shakes them to death. Alternately, why they have to get a dodgy inspection to get their new acquisition on the road. As most vehicles have a large array of Commonwealth Exemption modifications.
map1275
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Post by map1275 »

Commercial demand is about 20 years too late. Once again, I doubt Perentie or Bushmaster is the target market.

Quite simply look at how few Faireys are available for the LT95 anywhere?
How old is the average Fairey?
How knackerd is the average Fairey?
How expensive is the average Fairey to rebuild? and they all have the same problems.

I don't know about "in Australia" but I think if you ask in any market, the Fairey is considered 'delicate' to use.

I would suggest you look at how many other vehicles are already out there which have an LT95.

I would personally prefer the Laycock unit having worked on them when an apprentice. However I would be happy with an ageing Fairey if I could get one. Plus of course and adaptor (linkage) kit that actually fits.
map1275
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Post by map1275 »

If you want to produce items for Perentie and Bushmaster, then look at all their faults and address them first as that's what clients will moan about first.

- why 6x6 won't stop,
- engine brake conversion,
- braided lines to reduce fluid loss when cornering,
- a clutch that doesn't slip,
- a rear main seal that doesn't leak,
- servo assisted clutch master so you can push the super heavy clutch you've developed,
- compliancing IIMV to use its rear seats for road use,
- steering boxes that aren't rebuilt by the ADF,
- bigger turbos for the dumb greedy owners,
- free flow exhaust that the ADF proved worked but then turned down...

4X4
- compliancing to use their rear seats for road use,
- alternate roll cages/seat belt mounts that are safe and legal for road use,
- turbos for the dumb greedy owners,
- a rear main seal that doesn't leak,
- header rail levers that don't snap every time you touch them...



Plus back to researching what happened to Ser III....

Used 110 hardtops will be in big demand, dodgy knockoff soft tops for the tightwad owners,
map1275
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Location: Brisbane, Australia

Post by map1275 »

A really big ask...
when I go to buy my LT95 Roverdrive, could I have a local agent that's a little more interested and actually has one on the shelf?
map1275
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Post by map1275 »

Correction, Bushranger not Bushmaster (Rollmaster) which is the poor knock off of Saladin/Sarison.
Jamie_grieve
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Post by Jamie_grieve »

I too would doubt there to be much of a demand either. Perhaps if it offered a deep reduction ratio as well then you would get demand from the off road community. I don't know if it would be possible to make a three stage planetery gearbox for the money people are prepared to spend. I've had a few Fairey overdrives and paid from £20 at a breakers yard in Hamilton to the last one was £200 from a bloke who knew what it was. We're getting used to the price of cheap crap from China and don't want to pay for anything now.
V8_Disco
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Post by V8_Disco »

I have been looking for an OD for a while, I might have found a good one but would have to fab the linkage.

I have driven a Def 90 with a Roverdive in Great bit of kit but at a price ...

Aidan
1982, Stage 1 SW LPG
1999, Disco 2 4.6 Stage 1 Heads ES Multipoint LPG
1976, 88 SW
1973, 88 Truck Cab
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firemanshort
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Need LT95 OD in America

Post by firemanshort »

Ray -

Thanks for at least asking the question. I have heard nothing but great reveiws for your other ROVERDRIVE products and I would love to have a ROVERDRIVE for my Stage One.

However, the feedback already given is near or about the reality of it.

I had a Fairey OD for my truck that I imported with it from the UK. It started whining and so forth and then grenaded. That was the end of that. I am sorely missing that top gearing when I wind down the American highways going from Land Rover event to event.

Used Fairey Range Rover OD's are on eBay.UK fairly consistently. They are a crap shoot as far as quality but most only go for 100 UK Pounds or so. Shipping to the US is at its chepaest another 150 UK pounds (and that does not including proper packaging) There are a few listings that pop up every so often that list one that is 'garaunteed' to work and they go for 300-400 UK pounds.

So, I think it is a great idea and you have a great product pedigree to build on but my humble and uninformed opinion is that the price-point would be too high and the demand too low to make a good business case for this.

You would be better off making a pattern for the Stage One appropriate shift linkage and selling just that. There is a demand for the proper fitting linkages. (More Range Rover OD's used than Stage One.)
-----------------------------------
Firemanshort
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Bumpkin
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Post by Bumpkin »

I have sold my Stage 1 now but still have bits left over.On the O/D unique linkage, it is very simple to make.I copied an original bar by just beating a length of 12mm bar in the vice with a lump hammer to create the same part. Drilled a hole each end and made the slot with a slitting disc in a 5" angle grinder. Not pretty to look but simple to make. A much nicer job can be done if you have some propane. I'll post a piccy. The block is just a piece of 30mm Square with bit cut out and 3 holes drilled in it. I'll dig the linkage out and post a piccy if you like.
Tel
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V8_Disco
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Post by V8_Disco »

Hum Thats intesting Tel, Be good to have a photo

Aidan
1982, Stage 1 SW LPG
1999, Disco 2 4.6 Stage 1 Heads ES Multipoint LPG
1976, 88 SW
1973, 88 Truck Cab
tallergypsy
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu Dec 31, 2009 1:05 am

Roverdrive Overdrive

Post by tallergypsy »

Thank you all for the input. I'm glad to see we are known and respected.
Making an LT 95 overdrive is not a huge investment for us as the units would share 85% of the parts with the LT230 units.
I think I'll just go ahead and make a few and see what the demand is.
Answering some of the points raised. I can't see our Australian Dealers stocking them unless there is a robust demand but they could be on the shelf here for quick shipment. I can see that the military units in Australia will need quite a bit of work to get 'street legal' but I'm sure some local suppliers would rise to the challenge.
I have to say that from personal experience the Australian built vehicles with the MD11B are a very sweet Land Rover to own. My 1986 110 with the MD11B has given sterling service on expeditions here and in Africa and is much better build quality than the UK build of my other 110 which is the North American NADA 110 of 1995. This is a horror show of leaking seams and poor paint. The 1986 is tight, well finished and far more reliable.

Ray
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Raggylad
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Post by Raggylad »

I drive a 1983 110 V8 with an LT95 box. Once I had decided that I wanted to go down the overdrive route, I fairly rapidly acquired a Range Rover Fairey overdrive through this forum for a fair price; it then took ages to find the correct linkage.

Anyway, it was fitted in late 2008 and is going well (touching wood firmly). I have heard that the LT95 Fairey overdrives are meant to be much more robust than the units fitted to all other Landrover boxes and am hoping that this is true ! All the parts to reinstate 4 speed only are carried in the truck at all times as a backup though ....

To answer the question: I have heard nothing but good things about the Roverdrive unit and (when I was looking) was disappointed to find that there wasn't an LT95 version, so it is good news to hear that you are going ahead. That being said, It is a pretty limited market in the UK as there are only relatively few LT95 trucks still around; £1200 unit price may cause a little consternation as well - particularly in the current economic climate. My truck, for example only cost £2000 to buy in 2006 & prices haven't changed much.

Also very willing to be a UK prototype tester !

Good luck !

Nick
1983 110 V8 Station Waggon - LPG converted

There is nothing, absolutely nothing, quite so much fun as messing about in boats
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